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The Values and Visions Shaping Idaho

Main Street Town Hall Episode 10—Representative Josh Wheeler

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Representative Josh Wheeler from District 35 comes back for another episode with our host and Executive Director, Brennan Summers. Josh breaks down his own core values and motivations for leading in the Idaho Legislature, as well as his own efforts to pass provisional licenses for internationally trained physicians.

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Eric Stamps 2/27/24 Eric Stamps 2/27/24

Protecting Idaho’s Borders

Main Street Town Hall Episode 9—Representative Kenny Wroten

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Joining us from the Idaho State Capitol is Representative Kenny Wroten from District 13B. Wroten comes straight from the Judiciary Rules Committee to talk about the latest topics affecting Idahoans. Among them, human trafficking through Idaho borders, the enactment of fentanyl mandatory minimums, and potential concerns for school choice tax credits.

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Eric Stamps 2/23/24 Eric Stamps 2/23/24

Idaho’s Success

Main Street Town Hall Episode 8—Senator Treg Bernt

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Senator Treg Bernt from District 21 returns for another round of legislative updates from the Senate floor. Bernt walks us through his daily routine at the capitol building, the current bills he’s supporting within higher education, and his advocacy for updated school facilities throughout Idaho. He continues to break down the continuing success of the Idaho LAUNCH program and a behind the scenes look at legislation to come.

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Eric Stamps 2/12/24 Eric Stamps 2/12/24

Supporting Law Enforcement

Main Street Town Hall Episode 7—Senator Todd Lakey

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Longstanding Idaho Senator, Todd Lakey—District 23, joins us to shed light on the current objectives of the Idaho Legislature to support law enforcement throughout the state. As the fentanyl crisis increases, so does the Senator's fight to impose mandatory minimums for its drug traffickers. Lakey additionally breaks down how he plans to support the uncontested border crisis, expanding resources for law enforcement, and alleviating property tax burdens for Idaho citizens.

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Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (00:00):

Welcome to Main Street Podcast, an opportunity to talk to Idaho's elected leaders about the issues that matter to you. Good morning and welcome to Main Street Idaho. I am here today with Senator Todd Lakey at a District 23 Senator Lakey. Good morning.

Senator Todd Lakey, District 23 Idaho (00:23):

Morning Brennan. Thanks for the opportunity to be here and kind of reach out to your folks.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (00:28):

Yeah, we're excited to talk to you. A lot of issues that we need to cover today and never enough time to do it. But you're a seasoned veteran. As the Idaho legislature gets younger and younger, your experience gets more and more, I won't say older and older, but this is your sixth term now, is that correct?

Senator Todd Lakey, District 23 Idaho (00:46):

Yeah, my sixth term. Boy, it's gone really fast and that's 12 years, but in that 12 years, I think I'm third in seniority, so it just flies by and there's a lot of natural turnover, but it's gone fast, but I'm still enjoying serving, so it's been great. I love doing it.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (01:06):

Natural turnover and some unnatural turnover too. But you've managed to survive that 12 years. How has the legislature changed in that decade?

Senator Todd Lakey, District 23 Idaho (01:18):

Decade? Oh, you get new faces and sometimes you get new perspectives. The spectrum among our party shifts a little bit here and there. I like to think in the Senate where we're a little more reasoned and take a particularly thoughtful approach, but sometimes you get new folks that they learn with experience about how the Senate operates. But I'll say our spectrum shifts a little bit in the party with new faces depending on who's coming in.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (01:57):

Are there issues you look back on that you're most proud of being able to tackle or problems you've been able to solve in the last 12 years?

Senator Todd Lakey, District 23 Idaho (02:07):

Oh boy. Yeah. I mean, it's been a great experience. I particularly appreciate the opportunities I've had over the years to support our law enforcement community as chairman of JU Rules, and I was a prosecutor when I started my career and working with them has really been a pleasure. Whether it's taking opportunities to, I look at it as strengthening our criminal laws. You have to have a balance of justice and mercy, so to speak. But I think Idaho's a great place to live because we take crime seriously and we appreciate safe communities and supporting our men and women of law enforcement is part of that. We have some wonderful men and women that serve, and I try to be supportive of them.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (03:01):

Love that. So, excuse me, let's delve in a little bit more on that. You mentioned that you're the chairman of Judiciary Rules and you have a different seat when it comes to law and order than a lot of Idahoans. Most Idahoans experience with police or law enforcement is a patrol car on the side of the highway checking speeds, and that's a good thing. And sometimes maybe our men and women in blue do such a good job that they go unnoticed and underappreciated. Maybe give us a glimpse into what our law enforcement Idaho is dealing with now and how those are some new and ever-changing problems.

Senator Todd Lakey, District 23 Idaho (03:41):

Sure. Well, I mean, they're always dealing with a changing and more aggressive, and I guess even technologically advanced criminal element in society, their ability to engage in criminal activity, particularly in drug trafficking. They use technology to do that. They're all about the business of making more money, and they find new ways to do that. And I think that's particularly the fentanyl issue that I know you've all talked about before, but that's something that's really, it's the most dangerous criminal change, I guess, as law enforcement describes it that we've seen ever. And it's replacing things like heroin is the worst of the worst, and law enforcement, they have to carry Narcan to save people's lives they come in contact with and save each other's lives. If somebody accidentally searches somebody or opens their wallet while they're being booked in the jail and a puff of fentanyl comes out, it puts the opposite flat on the ground and in the hospital, unless they help them quickly. So I think that fentanyl issue is one of the most serious and lethal changes we've seen in the criminal history of Idaho.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (05:06):

Now, we spoke at length with the representatives Dixon and Gardner about the mandatory minimums and House Bill 4 0 6, and it's good timing because that bill just went through your committee yesterday. So give us an update of where that mandatory minimums with fentanyl's at and where it's going.

Senator Todd Lakey, District 23 Idaho (05:27):

Thanks, Brendan. So that's a bill we've actually been working on and trying to achieve in various forms for three or four years now. I've been working with law enforcement and some of my co-sponsors for quite a while, and it's faced a different resistance. Some folks just feel like mandatory minimums aren't appropriate, and there was that recent survey that shows that 86% of Idahoans think need to add fentanyl to the mandatory minimum statutes. They're seeing the growing problem and the lethality of it. And we had a good debate in, well, I should say from listen to folks in the hearing yesterday in my committee, I carried the bill, so I didn't share the meeting, but presented the bill and there was strong support in our committee came out six three. But there's efforts to amend it, to water it down, to take out the mandatory portions to change the intent language that we, it's the exact same language that we have for meth, cocaine, and heroin. So it's something law enforcement and the courts are used to dealing with, but those that oppose it want to change that and make it easier for dealers to do business in Idaho. The safest drug to deal in Idaho right now is fentanyl because it's not covered in that mandatory sentencing.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (06:57):

Wow. So it passed your committee six three, as you mentioned. I know there's a great quote from you about how you believe this is going to be a deterrent and if passed, then it's going to lead people away from Idaho when it comes to trafficking fentanyl. Now, where does it go to the Senate floor, and then what's the outlook there?

Senator Todd Lakey, District 23 Idaho (07:19):

We've been working on this a lot, and there is strong support. They try to attack tangential aspects of it. We do also have included in it a drug-induced homicide. So somebody sells somebody some fentanyl and the person dies. If we can establish that they violated the criminal code regarding that trafficking or that possession and that drug killed them, they can be held accountable for a drug-induced homicide. It's not murder, it's not the death penalty. The judge has discretion on what to do with them in that context. But I think what folks are really trying to do is get it somewhere where they can amend it to do more than just that. And we worked on that language with prosecutors, and it's important 25 other states have that and even have more serious penalties. But from here, it goes to the floor. Like I said, I think we have strong support for it, and I also anticipate that there'll be further efforts like we saw in committee to amend it, to stop it, and we'll just have to keep our support strong and resist those things and get it to the governor.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (08:36):

And you work very closely with Governor Little. Is there any indication that he wouldn't sign a bill like this?

Senator Todd Lakey, District 23 Idaho (08:41):

No, not at this point. He's been very strong on Fentanyl. He's talked a lot about what a scourge it is on Idaho, and he's talked about how it comes across the border and it's a focus, but we also need to work it like any other bill and make sure that we convey to him the importance of the issue, the importance of the legislation, and garner his support.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (09:08):

Yeah. So you mentioned the southern border in national news. There's been a lot of drama recently over legislation on how and if and when and where to address our southern border. And it's a lot of fireworks in the US Senate in the Idaho Senate. What can you do, and where are you at when you look at the problems of fentanyl, flooding Idaho from the southern border, the lack of really any kind of controlled response by the Biden administration as an elected leader? What goes through your mind?

Senator Todd Lakey, District 23 Idaho (09:43):

Well, I mean, it's just really clear to me that the federal government, the Biden administration has failed us and that border policy, most of the fentanyl comes across the border from Mexico. After the cartels. They get the elements and the ingredients for fentanyl and make it in Mexico and ship it across the border through there. And there's just no control. They're, they're not taking responsible action to limit it really in any significant way. And they're stopping states that are Texas that are trying to take some action on their own to control it. So it's just really a failure. And I hear a lot of comments from my constituents about their concern for the illegal immigration coming across the border and the border being so porous. We are limited as state legislators and what we can do. We have authority within our own borders. I think we try to support our fellow states and do our best to make sure Idaho is safe, but we can try to influence our fellow congressional delegation. But I know they're supportive, so it's kind of trying to do what we can, but I think ultimately it's going to take a change in administration at the federal level.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (11:10):

Sure. Frustrating to say the least. On a more optimistic tone, let's talk about some things that you actually can do. Like we mentioned before, you deal with law enforcement often and they come and they talk to you, they testify in your committees, they bring in their canines. Talk us through some of the issues that they're having outside of the Fentanyl challenge that they're communicating to you, that you're either drafting policy, have already passed policy, or maybe it's something down the road that can alleviate some of the challenges that they're experiencing.

Senator Todd Lakey, District 23 Idaho (11:42):

Sure. We've worked on various issues with them over the years. Human trafficking is one. We all know that that's a growing problem, and it's kind of the ugly underbelly of society that's often hidden on social media. But it's a problem not only in sex trafficking, but they traffic humans for employment, almost indentured servitude, that kind of thing. And we worked with them to try to give them more tools to be more effective in combating that. We changed, for example, the human trafficking crime to be its own crime, not an accessory crime to assault or battery or those violent crimes. It's its own crime that you can prove and convict someone of. And we're doing some updates this year on human trafficking, adding some of the forfeiture provisions like we have for drug dealers where if they're selling drugs out of their car, their boat, or those kinds of things, you can take the things that they use, hit them economically where they do business and seizing that property if it's used in human trafficking.

(12:57):

Another issue, our men and women of law enforcement, our first responders really face some horrific things every day. They see things that you can't really get out of your head sometimes the broken bodies, the murder scenes, I've seen a few of those as a prosecutor long ago, and it affects them mentally. And we've done some things to try to help them make sure that those kind of mental impacts are still covered and addressed in their retirement system. Their critical injuries are covered in the law enforcement retirement system. We've passed the ability to have peer counseling worked on all of those issues where they can talk to their fellow officers in regards to the things they deal with. You often see that counseling thing in human resources, but talking one-on-one to law enforcement amongst themselves with people that understand their issues helps them. So it's not just about the criminal justice part, it's about helping them deal with life as well.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (14:05):

Wow. Yeah, a lot there that we wouldn't imagine were resources that were needed and that are now available. You in judiciary rules don't handle their budgets that would go through jac, correct?

Senator Todd Lakey, District 23 Idaho (14:20):

Correct. JAC does give me an opportunity to talk to them every year, at least they have in the past. And so I try to be supportive of those requests that I think are important. So I do get a chance to usually go in front of J FFA and say, okay, here's what law enforcement or courts are asking for and try to be supportive that way. But I'm not on J fac, so I don't make the actual decision. I just try to be supportive.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (14:47):

So as you offer your views and what your hopes are happen in budgets, how do you walk the tightrope between a fiscal conservative that wants to safeguard the public trust in their tax dollars and return as much of Idaho's hard earned money back to them, but also making sure that expenditures that will keep Idaho and safe and empower police are also spent and invested? How do you make those decisions?

Senator Todd Lakey, District 23 Idaho (15:19):

I think it's kind of like anything else. You look at it and you try to evaluate the need and what they're proposing and then the pluses and minuses of it, what's the benefit to it, what's the cost? But things like enhanced funding for Post, which is where our law enforcement officers go to get certified and making sure they're adequately staffed and there are opportunities for our local law enforcement to go there and be adequately trained. You want to support that because if they're not adequately trained, they're not dealing maybe in the best professional manner with the public, and they also may be creating liability for their local entity. So you want to make sure your law enforcement is very well trained for their own personal safety, but also the taxpayers that they serve and they work with. So those are the kind of things that I kind of go through in my head when I'm looking at what to support and what not to support for law enforcement.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (16:27):

Okay. Yeah, that makes perfect sense. So shifting gears now, we want to take advantage of having a seasoned veteran on, and as you look into your crystal ball, give us an update or some predictions of what you think will happen for him now until the end of the session. What are some things insider baseball wise that we can look forward to seeing? Are there new issues and bills that are going to pop up out of nowhere? Are we expecting an early ending to the session? What's your prediction?

Senator Todd Lakey, District 23 Idaho (16:56):

Oh, boy. So it's an election year. Everybody knows that we have to run again in the primary. Usually that's incentive for everybody to get done timely and get back in their districts and talk to their folks and get ready. So that's usually incentive this time of year to just be efficient and get things through. We are having, there's a new approach to JAC this year, and that's causing a little bit of friction. Anytime you have a new process and change, they're trying, basically the idea is they're trying to look at what's called a maintenance budget and get that looked at and passed first, and then look at specific line item requests. So that's creating a little bit of just delay as we're trying to figure out that process. They are still hearing budgets, and we should probably see, I think that log jam break up a little bit now that things are starting to get figured out and we'll get more budgets out, but I don't know that it's really causing that much of a delay once you get back on top of it because they have been hearing budgets.

(18:08):

Also every year as Republicans, we try to provide some additional tax relief, and that's one thing. As a senator, I kind of have to watch and wait and see what the house gives us because they have that constitutional responsibility to generate the tax bills from the house. But I know there's always some effort to look at income tax reduction, maybe some additional property tax reduction. We did a big property tax reduction bill last year that I've heard from constituents and I've seen on my own tax bill that have made a good impact. So I think we'll see some kind of tax relief bill come forward. I'm not sure what that's going to look like yet. Lots of people have different ideas and we'll see what's conglomerated to the final bill.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (18:56):

Sure. As you go back to your district, district 23, what are you going to tell the constituents of ada, Hawaii and Canyon Counties as you reapply to return as senator for them?

Senator Todd Lakey, District 23 Idaho (19:11):

Well, I always run on my foundational principles first. I'm about trying to support a strong Idaho economy where people have an opportunity to build a good life for themselves with the lightest touch of government on those lives. And so they really have an opportunity to make life better themselves. I don't think governments there to make people's lives better by inserting itself. It's really to provide them an opportunity to do that. I'll continue to talk about my strong stance in supporting law enforcement and making Idaho a great place to live. And another issue I've been working on this year is the Convention of States. We talked about federal problems and jurisdiction, and that's an effort that our founding fathers gave us to as states propose constitutional amendments. If we have two thirds of the states that ask for that, we can get together and propose amendments. And the amendments we're looking at are things like a balanced budget, the federal jurisdiction issue, and maybe even term limits. So trying to really make sure that state's rights are respected. And then I always every year try to look at how we can reduce the tax burden on our citizens, but also make sure we're providing those necessary services. And with a strong economy, we've been able to do that.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (20:46):

Now, I'm going to probably get in trouble for this one because this podcast is supposed to kind of stay specific to the policies and the topics of the day. But I've got to squeeze in a question that in season one of the podcasts, we asked all of our guests, and since it's a first time year on, I'm going to have to ask, what is one book that you would recommend that everybody reads

Senator Todd Lakey, District 23 Idaho (21:07):

One book? Well, I think if it's kind of personal improvement related, I really like, historically it's 20 years old, but seven Habits of Highly Effective People. I think it helps you focus on what's really important in life and set your values and make your decisions based on that.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (21:31):

All right. Seven habits. And if it's not personal improvement, one just off your shelf, what are you reading?

Senator Todd Lakey, District 23 Idaho (21:38):

Boy, I'm kind of a fantasy escapist reader guy, so Tolkien's always one of my favorites. Lord of the Rings.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (21:48):

Love it. Love it. See, we get to learn more about you every day, Senator, you're well known both in and outside the Capitol as being somebody who is the adult in the room that is easy to work with, that can build consensus. And we really appreciate you taking aside some time for us today. We know you're busy with your chairmanship and everything going on. A lot of candidates run on backing the blue, and I think it's obvious that supporting our law enforcement isn't just a campaign tagline for you. So we hope to have you back on as we talk about some more issues in the future. But we really do appreciate your time today. Senator

Senator Todd Lakey, District 23 Idaho (22:22):

Brennan, thank you so much for the opportunity.

Speaker 3 (22:32):

Eric Stamps 2/7/24 Eric Stamps 2/7/24

Budgets, Investment, and Oversight

Main Street Town Hall Episode 6—Rep. McCann & Rep. Sauter

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Joining us from Boise, Representative Lori McCann and Representative Mark Sauter elaborate on their successes and active roles in the Idaho Legislature. Our host and Executive Director, Brennan Summers, learns of the legislators'' ongoing pursuit to balance the Idaho budget, as well as the management oversight for the North Idaho Community College.

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Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (00:00):

Welcome to Main Street Podcast, an opportunity to talk to Idaho's elected leaders about the issues that matter to you. Welcome to Main Street, Idaho. Another episode of the podcast. We're excited today to have two very friendly faces on joining us. Two representatives both out of Northern Idaho, representative Lori McCann and Representative Mark Sauter. Representative McCann, you are coming out of District six, that's correct, right?

Representative Lori McCann, District 6 Idaho (00:30):

That is correct. District six encompasses all of Lake Talk County, all of Lewis County, and a small part of Nesper County. That's correct.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (00:40):

And then Representative Sauter, you're from the most Northern Legislative District, the district one.

Representative Mark Sauter, District 1 Idaho (00:48):

I am. And that's all of Boundary County. And Boundary County is the northern most county in Idaho, and 27 of the 30 precincts in Bonner County. So almost all of Bonner as well.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (01:02):

Yeah, no, it is bright and early in Boise today. I would say that we dragged you out of bed for this, but you two are up and ready for a day full of meetings, and we appreciate you inside a little bit of time to chat with us. It's a busy time in Boise right now. Now, representative McCann, this is your second term. How does this session compare to sessions that you've dealt with in the past?

Representative Lori McCann, District 6 Idaho (01:23):

Well, it is equally as busy. I think that where my feet are a little more set and knowing which way to run, I feel a little better about that. But there's still a lot of things that we're trying to deal with that you have to figure out, build relationships and try to get things across that are important. And sometimes I feel we spend a lot of time spinning our wheels on issues that I'd rather not be spending time on and get to the things that the people really are asking for, like additional property tax relief, those kinds of things. But we're just taking one step at a time and trying to get there.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (02:10):

Sure, sure. Representative Sauter, you've got a fantastic background as a former firefighter and fire chief. Individuals in that role I imagine have to become pretty good at identifying the priority and then putting out the problem. Do you feel like the legislature as a whole right now is prioritizing the correct problems?

Representative Mark Sauter, District 1 Idaho (02:32):

Good question. Somewhat. Yes. We are running bills and they're really in the works for tax relief. There are bills out there to deal with current issues that we have. I'm trying to run a bill on some school board changes in our state statute. We had an issue up in North Idaho at West Barner School District, and we need to account for some of the issues that that board had to deal with after a recall election. So I'm bringing a bill to deal with that. So in that respect, I think we're on task, but I think it's easy to look at our session, I think this is the fifth week, and say, well, where are we right now? What really matters is what we get at the finish line. So sometimes the old adage, you don't want to watch sausage being made or government being done.

(03:37):

And in that case it's kind of true. And the other thing is the bills that we talk about over here on the house side, they have to get through the Senate, they have to get a signature by the governor, and then they have to go through potentially even the court system. So it's hard to tell today how successful we will be with almost all of our efforts, but we are moving forward trying to get things done. And I think that's a good thing. And back to Representative McCann's point, I've only been here, this is only my second session. This session seems a lot faster. We're seeing bills be introduced, seems like on Monday, and we're voting on 'em, the floor on Friday. It's a little bit of an exaggeration, but it's hard to really to get in. And by the time a bill gets printed, sit down, read it, really think it through for your own district, maybe even check in with some local experts in your own area, law enforcement or fire or government, city government or county government, and then ask the bill, sponsor some questions and then vote on it. And that's a pretty fast time frame when you think we've already got, I must be 50 bills on our reading list. So that's what keeps you hopping is the speed of things too. It's not just the number, but to try and forecast how different bills will affect your area. That's the essence of what we're supposed to be doing. And making it faster just increases the difficulty. But anyway, we're hanging in there, we're doing it.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (05:32):

See of course we're noticing the same challenge or not challenge. We're noticing the same speed at which things seem to be moving. It's hard for us as voters and constituents at times to be able to keep up because it seems like things are moving quickly, which as you mentioned has its challenges, but also has its benefits. Representative McCann, if this session ended today, what would you consider the greatest winner accomplishment that you guys have been able to do up until now?

Representative Lori McCann, District 6 Idaho (06:02):

I guess I would say that we were able to pass through the house anyway, a fentanyl bill to take a look at adding fentanyl to the list of mandatory mandatory minimums. Thank you. And the fact that Fentanyl wasn't part of that list. And while my judges in my district were not crazy about mandatory minimums, they don't like any mandatory minimums, but they I think realize that we had to do something because fentanyl has become such a scourge on society, and I would be really proud that we were able to push that. So that one has moved through the house pretty quickly is over in the Senate right now. So I think that might be the best one that I can recall that we've passed through the house. But there's several others that I'm looking forward to. And sometimes you're working behind the scenes to help something not pass.

(07:15):

So it just depends on what the situation is. I've got a couple of bills that I'm really excited about working on from my background, education, business and agriculture or my three main areas, and I'm working on a V in egg that will help us hopefully gain a few more seats for vet students. The Utah state has a new vet school, so I'm running a concurrent resolution with the Senate to try to say, okay, university of Idaho, we're going to give you some authority to go in and negotiate you and the State Board of Education to try to get us maybe 10 or 11 seats in their vet school that we help participate in. And of course then next year there would be a fiscal note there. But right now it's just giving them the authority and then looking down the road because we are kind of in a crisis at this moment with our large vets.

(08:25):

Their average age is like 62 or three years old, and they are all retirement age and a lot of the younger students want to do small vet instead of large vets. So we are finding that it is a crisis in many of our rural areas. So we're hoping this might lead down the road to some kind of a program where we can incentivize students to take the vet and then the state maybe picks up a bit of their student debt like in the rural nursing bill or even in the whammy program. So that's an exciting one for me.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (09:09):

That is exciting. So we've got fentanyl covered. We've got large vets covered representative Sauter. What are you thinking?

Representative Mark Sauter, District 1 Idaho (09:17):

Well, you said if it ended today, I don't think from the constitution part of our government, we could end today not to be a smarty, but we need to pass a bunch of budget bills. That's our number one priority here is in the house or in the capital, is to pass a balanced budget and to develop and pass a balanced budget. So that said, I think the fentanyl bill so far has been the one bill that's passed through the house that I think has been something that we've really needed to do. Like all legislation, we can all find different issues with it, but that was the best bill we could get past the line for us. I'd like to see us do some repairs to our state statute on school board activity, but we need to get a hearing on that. So anyway, fentanyl. And then just a reminder that we do need to do quite a bit of budget work before we leave the house. Thank you.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (10:25):

And we all greatly anticipate how those budgets will play out and what will be funded and what will get cut. So it'll be interesting to watch that sausage get made. Now both of you sit on the House education committee with Representative McCann of Vice Chair. You also both sit on the Ag Affairs committee, but you're also both from northern Idaho as was mentioned. And there's been an issue that's come out that overlaps with both Northern Idaho and education that I think a lot of our listeners would love to hear about. And it revolves around the North Idaho College. And so maybe for those who haven't been following the issue, representative McCann, why don't you give us a brief overview of what's been happening with the North Idaho College that has caused such a fuss and what we can look forward to happening in the future there?

Representative Lori McCann, District 6 Idaho (11:12):

Sure. This was something that Representative Sauter and myself really took on last session. And so for the listeners who haven't followed North Idaho College, Idaho, north Idaho College and I see is a community college, which is funded in part by a tax base there that the residents of the area pay some taxes to. And the state also then kicks in money. And over the last 10 years, the state has put in over 200 million. So we have a big interest in making sure that our community colleges continue. So NIC has had, I guess I would put it some issues with managing in their trustee area. And some of the trustees have not agreed how NIC should be operating. And so over time it has put them on notice with the accrediting body that they needed to make changes or they could run up against losing their national or their regional, I guess, accreditation.

(12:30):

So when this all came to light and they were put on notice, mark and I decided we needed to jump in here and see what we needed to do to try to help from the state's perspective in the law, there really is nothing that says if a community college is to lose their accreditation, then what happens next? So we worked hard with the state board. We went to the governor's office, we worked with NIC, and we put together some bills that would help protect the assets and so forth. Well, we were not able to move that. We went to the speaker and we tried really hard to get that through so we could have a public hearing and we were not able to. So we kind of put that on hold. And NIC now has just had their last meeting with their accrediting body and they will know in the next few months, I guess hopefully before we're out of session, we'll have some indication.

(13:44):

And I would say that they are, we're really proud of them. They've worked really hard despite a few naysayers who would like to see the college I think go down. And so under the helm now of President Swain, I am hearing really good things that they're working hard, doing what the accrediting body asks them to, despite in the governance that they don't have control over. Sometimes what happens with the folks that get to vote in, but I'll let Mark kick in there, but I think that NIC is on a road of recovery. Their student enrollment for freshmen has gone up about 20% in this next, that what they are anticipating. And so that's an excitement because we wanted to make sure that parents and the people who this means a lot up in North Idaho, kids from the Canadian border all the way down here in the southeast portion of the state do attend NIC. And so we were getting calls and emails from parents that were concerned, and I think that we're looking good. And while we won't know the full ramification, and like I said for a few months, but in Mark and my view, they are the jewel of North Idaho in terms of education and what we have in our state, and we're real proud of them and their career in technical programs. So I'm going to let Representative Sauter add a few things in. He's been really working with this as well.

Representative Mark Sauter, District 1 Idaho (15:36):

Alright, a few things. Just from a local politics perspective, about 25 to 30% of our high school seniors in my area, and there's five different high schools all plan on being involved with NIC. So whether they're taking an NIC course as a junior or a senior in high school or planning to move on to NIC once they graduate, or in addition, be involved in their career technical courses, they have a whole campus of career tech classes for welding and plumbing and electricians and diesel mechanics. So it really, it's a big career step for our local kids. The other thing is it's a very conservative and smart way to begin your, if you want to go through college, because that's a good inexpensive way to get your first two years of college accomplished. And then last year we had the launch program that was started here in the capitol and that feeds into encouraging kids to go on.

(16:59):

You'll hear that the phrase go on. And I think in Idaho we have a go on rate that means high school seniors that go on to more training, whether it's career tactical training or community college or even four year schools are go on rate in our state. I think last year was like 38%. And if you talk to people in the industry and in the job market, as we know, we have lots of skilled jobs that are going unfilled. Many believe that that go on number needs to be 60%. Well, 38% to 60% is a pretty big leap. So the launch bill is in place. So we want to work on our future workforce in a lot of ways. One is to have good places to go. That's why Lori and I are working again on NIC. And then the other issue is the number one thing that students will tell you is why they don't go on is funding.

(18:04):

So we're helping with the funding with that as well. We look at it as an investment because the money that's used now for grants or scholarships for these students, they're going to pay it back. If you think about it, they're going to earn more. And we all know if you earn more, you end up paying a little more taxes. So the money's going to work out. You just have to look at it as an investment. So another part of NIC is they don't just do the first two years of a college education. They have what's called the Parker Center up in rum, and that's where all the career tech work goes on. Then they also have quite a nursing program, CNA program, dental assistant program, all of those are at capacity. So those are all, it's just a good pipeline of getting kids from their high school years into their working years and working professional years.

(19:07):

So as far as the school is concerned, operationally, I think they've done an amazing job state statute as far as what gives direction to schools. I think when our founding fathers and mothers and our past state legislators, when they stood up our community college system, they didn't anticipate that there could be problems and there could be interest in not having these schools continue. So they didn't put that in code. What do you do when a college loses accreditation or even goes on, or the status that NIC is now, which is on show cause which is close to losing your accreditation. So that was never really anticipated because I think our forefathers all thought, this is always going to be run well, and they're always going to do well. But in this case, they've had some issues. So the state has, Lori mentioned how much money the state's sent to NIC for operations the last 10 years.

(20:24):

But the other part of this is the state has about $500 million worth of buildings at NIC that they're all state structures. So the community has a big investment in that. And so does the state. One of the bills we ran last year, for instance, if NIC or any community college had lost its accreditation and they couldn't remedy that within I think it was two years, the state would step in and at least take over the maintenance of the buildings while who knows what happened. But we wouldn't want to let those assets go south or get sour. And another one of those bills was on governance, and that was if the elected board there could not remedy the loss of accreditation after two years, then the state board would've something to do with it to try and step in and get involved. Because after all, it's a real community asset there.

(21:29):

And there's kids from four or five counties that all count on NIC. So we really, Lori and I did not think that failure was really an option that we needed to give 'em some a backstop for the college. So again, it's a really well run place, but their governance is an issue. Now, there's quite a bit of information in the press about the issues with NIC, the governance part. For one instance, I think they're just getting rid of, or let's see, in June, their backup school president that's been on the payroll for it will be 18 months will be finished up their board elected to have a backup administrator for that time. That's expensive. I think the papers report that that was about a 300 or $325,000 expense. I don't think most colleges have a backup president that's on administrative leave. So that's an issue. Plus they've spent over a half a million dollars on legal bills in the last year, and that's a lot of taxpayer money on issues for a college that's running pretty well.

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (22:51):

Well, I think you've both painted the picture very well about why people throughout Idaho, not just in Northern Idaho, should care about this because of the assets that exist on that campus, because of the investment by the state and the tax dollars that flow through there. But I love the optimism. I love what a 180 this story has taken from being such a sad and dreary story of a community college on the brink of failure to resurrection and revival on campus. So we are out of time for the day, and I know you two have to run off to meetings, but I hope you know how much we appreciate you being on Representative Lori McCann, representative Mark Sauter, thank you so much for being here. We're going to have you back on as the session wraps up to cover some of those bills that haven't gotten off the finish line yet. Let's talk about 'em when they get complete. Does that work for you too?

Representative Mark Sauter, District 1 Idaho (23:40):

Perfect. Absolutely. Absolutely. Look forward to it. Thank you. Thanks

Brennan Summers, Executive Director Main Street ID (23:44):

Bren. Thank you both. Have a wonderful day. We'll see you.

Eric Stamps 1/29/24 Eric Stamps 1/29/24

Keeping Idaho Safe

Main Street Town Hall Episode 5—Rep. Dan Garner & Rep. Chenele Dixon

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Rep. Dan Garner Op-Ed re: Fentanyl

No corner of our great nation remains untouched by the devastating consequences of the fentanyl crisis. Even in Idaho, we see the firsthand results of a drug trade that starts across the border in Mexico with chemicals sourced from China. The finished product then spreads across the country, contributing to tens of thousands of deaths each year.

In response to this epidemic, Gov. Brad Little established Operation Esto Perpetua, a targeted law enforcement effort to combat the flow of fentanyl into our state. Now, the legislature needs to do its part. This session, I’ve joined with many fellow legislators to increase the penalties for fentanyl trafficking in Idaho by setting mandatory minimums for certain offenses.

Under the proposed legislation, possession and conviction of knowingly possessing 14 to less than 28 grams of fentanyl or 250 pills or less than 500 pills comes with a mandatory minimum of five years in prison for drug trafficking and a $15,000 fine. For possession and conviction of greater quantities, the mandatory sentence increases to 10 years in prison and a $25,000 fine.

The courts will have the option to impose life in prison and a $100,000 fine as the maximum sentence for trafficking fentanyl. The bill also provides an avenue for prosecutors to pursue a charge of drug-induced homicide if they can demonstrate that an individual died from drug ingestion. The drug supplier would then face a potential felony conviction and life in prison.

Trafficking fentanyl must come with severe consequences. In 2022, 270 Idahoans overdosed on opioid-related drugs. Almost half of those deaths were tied to fentanyl. The science tells us why. Fentanyl is 50 times stronger than heroin and 100 times stronger than morphine. Even the smallest of amounts carries the risk of death.

For years, Idaho’s mandatory minimums for drug trafficking have made the state a risky place for dealers. Recordings from jailhouse conversations and cellphone messages confirm that drug traffickers try to avoid Idaho because of the potential for serious jail time if caught. We need to maintain that standard when it comes to fentanyl.

Simple possession doesn’t equal trafficking. If someone chooses to come to this state with massive quantities of fentanyl, we can’t give them an easy out when caught. In this case, the standard requires a minimum of 14 grams or 250 pills. These are quantities that only make sense for someone engaged in the dirty business of drug dealing.

Our justice system assumes that everyone is innocent until proven guilty. Mandatory minimums for fentanyl trafficking will only come into play if the prosecution proves beyond a doubt that an individual committed the crime. We owe it to our friends, neighbors, and the future health and safety of our state to make sure fentanyl doesn’t find a safe haven in Idaho.

I encourage you to reach out to your representatives and senators. Ask them to support the fentanyl trafficking bill in the Idaho House and Senate. Your actions will help ensure law enforcement and our prosecutors gain one more tool to help fight back against the thoughtless and dangerous actions of those traffickers who bring fentanyl into our state.

- Rep. Dan Garner, District 28 (Bannock, Franklin, and Power counties)

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…

Follow Along With The Transcript

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (00:00):

Welcome to Main Street Podcast, an opportunity to talk to Idaho's elected leaders about the issues that matter to you. Welcome to the Main Street Podcast. We are here with representative Chanel Dixon out of district 24 and representative Dan Gardner at a district 28. Representative Dixon, thanks for joining us today.

Representative Chenele Dixon, District 24 Idaho (00:24):

Yeah, thanks for having me,

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (00:26):

Representative Gardner, appreciate you being on the podcast.

Representative Dan Garner, District 28 Idaho (00:29):

Thank you. It's always nice to be included.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (00:32):

Yeah, I was going to say this morning, you don't have the whole world in your hands. You have the whole world behind your back. So for those listening without any visuals, they've got a beautiful map of the world right behind them. And if we need to know where anything's at, representative Gardner's going to get up and play weatherman and point to the right area at the right time. Now then Representative Dixon, when you were on the podcast later in the summer in August I think is when you were on around that time, we talked about a number of issues and one of the things was the fentanyl crisis and the drug issues we're having in this state. So you've teamed up with Representative Gardner and we're working with a number of your colleagues on legislation to address that. Why don't you give us a brief overview of what House Bill 4 0 6 does and how that's working on some of the issues that your community's worried about?

Representative Chenele Dixon, District 24 Idaho (01:20):

Okay, so it is regarding fentanyl, which is, excuse me, one of the most dangerous drugs that's out there right now on our streets. And it sets fentanyl to our mandatory minimums that we currently have for marijuana, cocaine, meth, and heroin. We don't have fentanyl in there. And so this adds fentanyl and if someone was convicted of trafficking fentanyl, they would receive a mandatory minimum sentence and the weight would be two milligrams is a lethal dose. And so four grams is 2000 lethal doses. And so it would do that. And then the second part of the bill is a drug induced homicide. And so if someone received drugs and they died from it, the person that had provided those could be convicted of drug induced homicide and they would receive up to life in prison. And I think it's a maximum of $25,000 fine for that. So it's kind of a two-pronged approach to help keep Fentanyl off our streets.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (02:44):

Is that second part of the bill, is that also specific to fentanyl that if there was an overdose, is it fentanyl related or is it any drugs in general that would receive that?

Representative Dan Garner, District 28 Idaho (02:52):

It's specific to fentanyl, and I should clarify that that's not if someone gives, like if I was to give Representative Dixon an appeal, that's not me. I mean it is, but if I'm willing to turn over and say who I got the pills from, it would be then that person. So it goes up the chain. It's to the supplier. Yeah. This bill is designed to go after the traffickers and suppliers of this deadly drug.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (03:26):

That makes a lot of sense. Representative Garner of your time is spread thin in the little bit of time that you have in the Capitol for all of you legislators, of all the priorities that you have to deal with, why this one and why now?

Representative Dan Garner, District 28 Idaho (03:41):

I was at a Meet the Candidate forum in Bannock County and I'm a strong education supporter and I was explaining my policy on education and what I wanted to do with education. And then after the meeting, I had a young mother come up to me and say that if I did get elected, I needed to do something on fentanyl. She'd lost her child, her son, to fentanyl. And I talked with her probably for 30 minutes and heard her story of how dangerous this drug is. And I decided that if I did get elected, that was after the help in education, that was the next thing I was going to address

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (04:25):

A politician trying to keep a campaign promise. The press

Representative Dan Garner, District 28 Idaho (04:29):

Far is new, but

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (04:32):

Representative Dixon, I know you've heard similar stories from victim's parents. What is it that you've learned as you've talked to those that have experienced the worst of this crisis and how has that shaped this legislation?

Representative Chenele Dixon, District 24 Idaho (04:47):

Well, I think one of the things is when we spoke last time, and I had mentioned fentanyl, mandatory minimums. I knew it was a crisis during the summer in Twin Falls County. So in my district there was a drug bus. There were two drug busts within a month's time where they confiscated 15 pounds of fentanyl. And that's enough to kill everyone in Idaho, Montana, and most of Wyoming. And it has just progressed. I mean there was last month in December 5,300 pills seized in Idaho Falls. It's just growing. And when I had first started learning about this and talking about it, thinking about it, I talked to prosecutors and I talked to a lot of people, but one of the things that happened since I last talked to you, I had a friend who lost his daughter to a fentanyl overdose. And it does become a lot more personal when you hear those stories.

(05:57):

And it's tragic. I don't think most of the time when people die from a fentanyl overdose, they don't even know they're taking fentanyl because so many of the other drugs are being laced with fentanyl. And so a lot of times they may think they're taking, not that cocaine is healthy or anything, but they might be taking cocaine, but it's laced with fentanyl and that's actually what causes them to die. It really became a lot more personal when you have those connections. And I don't want it to get to the point where everybody has some connection to somebody that has died from fentanyl. We need to stop it now. And I think our mandatory minimums, if we can get fentanyl added to those, it will be a deterrent. We know it's been a deterrent in those other drugs to drug traffickers. They don't want to come into Idaho. The law enforcement has recordings of voicemails and texts of drug traffickers saying, we don't want to come to Idaho, but they know there's nothing for fentanyl here. But if we can get that added, it will be a deterrent. And I think in the end, the results of that is that we save lives of our children and our community members. So

Representative Dan Garner, District 28 Idaho (07:27):

Yeah, this drug is very, very potent. It's 50 times stronger than heroin and a hundred times stronger than morphine. And the public needs to realize that these pills that the DEA seizing, they're telling us and reporting to us that six out of 10 of those fentanyl pills contain a dead lethal dose.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (07:49):

Your bill focuses on traffickers because so many of the users are not necessarily willingly and knowingly taking fentanyl. Help us understand why is it that other drugs are laced with fentanyl unknowingly to the user.

Representative Dan Garner, District 28 Idaho (08:05):

It's cheaper for 'em to produce fentanyl than it is these other drugs. And by lacing these other drugs with fentanyl, they get a stronger high or what they perceive as a better high, not healthier for sure. And so that's why we're getting all this fentanyl from China coming in through Mexico.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (08:29):

Yeah, man, it's awful. So interesting. So you're saying number one, you can get people hooked and number two, it's cheaper to produce any idea how they're producing fentanyl?

Representative Chenele Dixon, District 24 Idaho (08:40):

Well, we know, I mean I'm not an expert in producing fentanyl, but it's coming over from China and they are, I think they produce part of it, right? And then it comes and it gets largely outside of the us, much of it in Mexico. And it can come in all different forms once it's produced. It can be powder, it can be pills, and then they mix it with whatever other drugs or whatever else they're mixing it with. So when we see it, when the law enforcement sees it in a car or whatever, they're having their drug bust. It can be powder, it can be pills, but it's a pretty, I don't know, it's pretty amazing how infiltrated our country is right now with fentanyl. So during the hearing that we had in our committee meeting, some DEA drug enforcement agency stats were shared with us.

(09:53):

And in 2023, what was actually seized around the country, well, it was across the border, so it doesn't only come from our southern border, we're also seeing it from the Canadian border coming into our country. But there were 76,500,000 pills of fentanyl that were seized and 19,000 pounds of fentanyl powder. And that is enough to kill 384 million people. So everyone in the United States, and they said that they think that probably four times that amount has actually gotten through because clearly they're not stopping everything that's coming through. So it's a serious crisis and we're seeing a lot of that in Idaho and we are kind of a thoroughfare to get to other states, and so we don't want any of it in our country, but we most certainly don't want to be the pass through or have any stops here in Idaho.

Representative Dan Garner, District 28 Idaho (11:03):

The other thing that I found interesting about this DEA report was that they're now starting to ship the ingredients to make the fentanyl into the US and they've actually seized a couple pill presses this side of the border. So it is a growing problem and we need to definitely support the blue on this issue and give them the tools they need to stop this fentanyl trafficking.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (11:30):

Let's talk about that. I've spoken to law enforcement local in eastern Idaho about fentanyl, and that is clearly the number one issue that they're dealing with. And the sheriff had said that he is a strong advocate of anything that will get this stuff off the streets, but that may be different. When you talk to law enforcement as a whole, as you speak to the law enforcement community, are they supportive of the legislation?

Representative Dan Garner, District 28 Idaho (11:55):

They are very supportive. All the law enforcement agencies that I've talked to are strongly in favor of this, and they ask us to pass it and give them this tool in their toolbox to help stop the deaths that are happening in Idaho.

Representative Chenele Dixon, District 24 Idaho (12:13):

Yeah, when I've talked to prosecutors and policemen, everybody that I've spoken to is very supportive of it.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (12:21):

So we have candidates that run and in their elections, most of them in Idaho particularly Republicans proudly announced that they back the blue and that they support law and order and tough on crime. So why is it that legislation like this hasn't been able to get across the finish line in the past, and who are the roadblocks to keep this from getting across the finish line? This session? Representative Garner, why don't we start with you?

Representative Dan Garner, District 28 Idaho (12:47):

I appreciate that. I think that's what was so frustrating last year was they weren't, well, I think they understood, but all we're trying to do is move the drug fentanyl into the mandatory minimums already that are there, the drugs that are covered by that, and it's a lot worse drug than these other ones. I think they used it as an opportunity to attack the idea of mandatory minimums. That's what slowed it down last year. And it's frustrating to me because how many Idaho lies have been lost in this year that it's taken to get it back before the legislature?

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (13:31):

Thoughts, representative Dixon?

Representative Chenele Dixon, District 24 Idaho (13:33):

Well, I think a lot of what we heard about the mandatory minimums last session came from testimonies from people who were out of state. And that was really interesting too, because when you have attorneys coming from other states to tell us what we should be doing in Idaho, it's, I don't know, a little disturbing. I guess this year we didn't see that the people who testified were from Idaho, but one of the things that we did see, we had some parents that shared their testimonies of losing their children to fentanyl. And it's tragic. I mean it's just so terrible to see the grief that families have. But interestingly, some of them were there to oppose the mandatory minimum sentence, which I had a hard time understanding because I feel like if we can keep fentanyl off the streets, then their children might still be here.

(14:42):

If we had been able to have fentanyl added already to our mandatory minimums, it might've saved their children. And so I think that's one of the things that people need to understand is that it's not going to throw your drug user into prison. It's aimed at the traffickers who are selling these drugs and bringing them into Idaho. And the mandatory minimums will decrease the trafficking in Idaho and decrease the amount of drugs in Idaho, and it will decrease the impact for drug users in Idaho. And it's just one prong, it's one leg of a stool that we have to try to help decrease drug use when we can decrease the amount of drugs coming in here. That's one prong. And then we have a lot of good programs in place throughout Idaho to help drug addicts. So we need all of those approaches to be successful to fight drugs here.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (15:53):

And the argument against mandatory minimums kind of universally is that you catch up people, people get caught up in the mandatory minimum that we're struggling, that we're having a bad day and turn 'em into hardened criminals and you ruined their lives. But again, I think it bears repeating the people that will be caught up in the mandatory minimums under this house bill are the traffickers are not the people who fell on hard times and couldn't break an addiction. These are people who've made a livelihood out of destroying other people's lives as other states around us go the opposite way in drug laws and decriminalization. Why is it so important that Idaho fights against the current in this world Representative Garner?

Representative Dan Garner, District 28 Idaho (16:40):

I think history will show that the opposite way doesn't work. We've got, like Chanel Dixon mentioned, they've got recordings of traffickers saying, I don't want to go through Idaho to their higher ups because of the mandatory minimums. I believe the mandatory minimums work, like you said, we're not going after the user. There's a 250 or a hundred pills. Think about the bottle of aspirin or Tylenol you buy at Walmart, how big that is. That's not for personal use, that's for trafficking or selling to others and destroying other people's lives. And these are the people we're going after. And if it stops one trafficker, then the drug cartel has to get another trafficker and sooner or later you're going to slow the chain and slow the flow. And I might add that only 2.9% of the incarcerations in the jails are for trafficking. And so the argument that we're going to fill up the jails or the prisons and clog the system is just not true.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (17:51):

Interesting. Now, I think it must be mentioned something that you don't have a lot of power over, but is a big problem in this that was briefly mentioned is the crisis at our southern border is not helping. It's fueling the issue. Representative dicks, why don't you speak a little bit to maybe this failed administration's attempts at border security and how that's only made your guys' lives more difficult as you fight this fentanyl crisis?

Representative Chenele Dixon, District 24 Idaho (18:16):

Oh, for sure. I mean, we need to close our border. We need to have legal immigration and a process and to just have our borders be open the way they are with this current administration is a disaster. And for the drugs coming in when they say that they think four times as much drugs have come in as what they've seized and they've seized 76 million fentanyl pills this year in 2023, that's a huge problem. And like you said, that's a federal issue and we are asking our federal government to do something about this because it's just unsustainable to have this amount of drugs coming in through our southern border. And I don't know, hopefully we can encourage and continue to encourage our federal government to do something because it's really becoming a scourge on the United States.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (19:30):

Absolutely.

Representative Dan Garner, District 28 Idaho (19:31):

I might add that these mandatory minimums on drug trafficking is the only tool, well, it's not the only tool, it's our way of addressing the southern border crisis and trying to tighten down Idaho's borders. And if they have to drive around Idaho, I'm very much happy with that result.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (19:55):

That's fair. Now what we need from you too is some insider baseball representative Dixon, you mentioned that the bill has been heard in your committee. Walk us through what the outlook and the path to passing this bill actually looks like.

Representative Chenele Dixon, District 24 Idaho (20:09):

Well, on Tuesday in our Judiciary and Rules committee, we'll meet again and we'll discuss as a committee all of the testimony that we heard and then we'll take a vote and if it passes out of committee, then it'll be heard on the floor of the house and we'll take a vote with all 70 members of the house. And then of course it'll go over to the Senate and kind of go through a similar process. And assuming that it passes, it will go onto the governor to be signed. And I mean, I am really hopeful that we can get it to the this time, last time we were not successful, but I'm very hopeful that we'll be able to get it to the floor this time.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (20:55):

Yeah, representative Garner, what's standing in the way? I mean, we've talked to Senator Cook about his cell phone bill and it seemed like such a no-brainer as we listen to it, but there are special interest groups with out-of-State money that are doing everything they can to rank it as the worst thing in Idaho. And this bill, oddly enough, has kind of a similar path of resistance where there are groups that are saying anything but this even though your attempt is to rid Idaho of fentanyl and protect our kids from overdose. If I'm a parent and I'm listening to the podcast right now and I'm thinking I want to do I have to do something about this representative, walk us through what we can do.

Representative Dan Garner, District 28 Idaho (21:38):

Well, representative Dixon mentioned there's a lot of out-of-state money being spent on this fighting it. And what I would encourage the public to do is to reach out to your state legislators, your senators, and your representatives and shoot 'em an email or call 'em and urge 'em to vote for House bill 4 0 6. Share your personal stories, let 'em know how it's touched your lives and let 'em know that you don't want it to touch your neighbor's lives.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (22:12):

Fantastic. We're wrapping up right now. Our time is dry nine, and I think it's important to note that it is bright and early when we're recording this. And this is not an eight to five job for you two. We started early, early this morning and you two are going to run off to a long day of meetings, no naps for you two today, but before we call it good for the day, fentanyl, addressing this fentanyl crisis is a priority for the two of you, but you're working on a number of issues. So Representative Garner, why don't we start with you and why don't you give us a few issues that you're working on off the top of your head that our listeners can look forward to seeing?

Representative Dan Garner, District 28 Idaho (22:49):

Well, I serve on the education committee and Agricultural Committee. I'm bringing a bill forward in the agricultural committee to clean up the statutes for soil conservation districts. There was some, it was very vague and we're just kind of solidifying a few things in that statute. And then of course, education's always a hot committee, and I'm sure you'll see my opinion on educational tax credits and different things like that as we move forward.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (23:19):

I'm going to go ahead and guess it's probably not in favor.

Representative Dan Garner, District 28 Idaho (23:23):

That is a good guess.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (23:26):

Representative Dixon, what are some things you're working on?

Representative Chenele Dixon, District 24 Idaho (23:29):

Well, one of the things is to add Idaho to the counseling compact. So there are about 30 states around the United States that have organized a compact for counselors. And so what that really does is allow people who live in a compact state to also practice, get a privilege to practice in another state that's part of the compact. And it's really also helpful for our military families because if they have a spouse that's a counselor and they come from a compact state to another one, they can easily start practicing. And so it will help access to counselors within Idaho. I think it's a good strong bill. So hopefully we can get it through to the end. And then another one that's kind of fun is a ski patrol bill. So I'm working on a bill that would bring volunteer ski patrollers under our Good Samaritan laws because we discovered that when they're the volunteer ski patrollers, they're not covered by mountain insurance to do what they are there to do and they have extensive training and getting people down the mountain, but we just need to get them some protection from liability as well. So that's what that bill will do. Then we'll probably hear that next week in JU Rules.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (24:54):

You just woke up our studio tech here who's a diehard skier. He just jumped, you're speaking his language. So he said, I hope those who are listening can tell how much you two are really trying to tackle the issues that your constituents are bringing to you. I think it's obvious that you're listening and if anyone out there has opinions, I'm sure you two are more than welcome to hear them, to fill them, and then to work on those issues. So as we close today, I hope you two know how much we appreciate you coming on the podcast and we'd invite you back on as the legislative storm starts roaring even louder here in the coming weeks.

Representative Chenele Dixon, District 24 Idaho (25:30):

Great. Thank you. Well, thank you Brandon. Yeah, thanks for having us. Appreciate that.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (25:33):

Okay, you too. Have a wonderful day and be safe. We'll see you.

Eric Stamps 1/24/24 Eric Stamps 1/24/24

Protecting Idaho’s Future

Main Street Town Hall Episode 4—Senator Cook & Rep. Mickelsen

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Hard to believe we are already in the third week of the 2024 Legislative Session!

The last few years have seen an increase in legislative activity in the education sphere. Education issues receive so much time and attention in the State House these days because it's the NUMBER ONE priority in the state.
Today’s podcast guests, Senator Kevin Cook and Representative Stephanie Mickelsen, are working hard in the areas of education policy and funding.

Cook and Mickelsen both represent District 32 (Bonneville County) in the Idaho Senate. In today’s podcast episode, these two go into detail on the new vision for investing in Idaho schools and some well-intentioned proposals that aren’t right for Idaho

Our children are the future.

One of the hot-button issues last session was a proposal for the creation of an Education Savings Account (ESA) program, and it sounds like a similar version of that bill will return again this year.

There is no bill yet, but our guests said the new proposal could be a state budget buster. There are numerous concerns they have about this proposal, including a lack of accountability and its constitutionality.

The Blaine Amendment to the Idaho Constitution serves as a separation of church and state, to prevent public dollars being used by private, religious institutions. This is why Idaho has a constitutional obligation to ensure a “common, thorough, free public education system”.

Currently, the State of Idaho is on excellent financial footing, but there is fear a proposal like this could put that situation in jeopardy. There are several states with similar programs in place, like the State of Arizona. After their ESA program was established, Arizona found themselves in a $400 million budget shortfall because they are losing over a billion dollars of potential revenue as a result of those tax credits. Such a significant shortfall can greatly affect a state’s ability to provide the essential services to keep things functioning and satisfy constitutional obligations to their citizens.

Senator Cook and Representative Mickelsen are excited about the passage of Idaho LAUNCH last session and the immediate results it has produced. The LAUNCH program is going to help fill the gaps for in-demand careers and accelerate the growth of Idaho businesses and industries. Representative Mickelsen noted there was already an enrollment spike at the College of Eastern Idaho, which proves more students are able to pursue post-secondary education and growth opportunities.

Follow Along With The Transcript

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (00:00):

Welcome to Main Street Podcast, an opportunity to talk to I Idaho's elected leaders about the issues that matter to you. Welcome back to I Idaho's Main Street podcast. I'm your host Brennan Summers, and really excited today to have two guests who we just had on talking about education issues. Today we're going to talk about something a little different. Really excited to have Senator Kevin Cook and representative Stephanie Mickelson coming live from the Boise State Capitol today. Talk to us and so they're in the middle of it. We're excited to get their perspective on a few things. Senator, thanks for joining us today.

Senator Kevin Cook, District 32 Idaho (00:40):

Thank you. Good to be here

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (00:42):

Representative. How's the sore throat feeling?

Representative Stephanie Mickelsen, District 32 ID (00:47):

It's getting better, but it's been a week, so hopefully another couple of days. I'll be completely over it. So

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (00:53):

Now both of you have been on the podcast before, twice now, and talked about a lot of different issues. When Senator Cook was on, one of the issues we talked about was some legislation that he was working on, and this was man back in the summer that we met Senator. Talk about this. My sister just recently discovered the podcast and she texted me last week and she said, I just listened to the segment with Senator Cook and I'm dying to know what happened with this cell phone bill that's supposed to protect kids. She has two kids that attend district 93, 1 in middle school and one in high school, and they just got their first cell phones for Christmas and she's very curious on how parents can get involved in this. So the first thing we got to do is note that this is an issue of importance. Senator, why don't you remind us a little bit about what this bill is that's supposed to protect our kids and some are deem a cell phone bill. Give us a little refresher on what the bill does.

Senator Kevin Cook, District 32 Idaho (01:46):

Alright. It's a very, very simple bill. It really is. It's basically if you have a mobile device and you activate it within the state of Idaho and you're activating it for a minor or it is the minor that's activating it, then turn on or enable the parenting filtering software software that is already installed on your mobile device. You don't have to subscribe, buy, purchase, or install it. It's already there. Just enable it, turn it on. And that's kind of the gist of it. When this passes as an adult, if you want to see objectional material harmful for minors, you have full rights to do that. You'll never see a difference when this bill passes, you'll continue to stream objectional material that you love. You'll be able to still see that. The only person that will really notice a difference will be minors. They will realize that, oh, I can't see that the objectional material that I wanted to see, and it should pop up and say, Hey, you know what?

(03:05):

You just clicked on a link and it has objectional material and we're not going to show it to you. And so that the miners will see that. But what this does, it does not take away your first amendment right from the adults and it gives you as parents some tools to help your kids, help them to keep them steer that social media that the internet safely. Now I say social media, this is a very, very narrow bill and it only has effect on search engines. So your search browsers and you might think, well, what the heck? What is that worth doing? It is not going to do anything. And I started to think that same thing all you've got Facebook and you've got Twitter and you X and your ex and Instagram and all the other social media stuff that kids get on and love.

(04:01):

And so this summer I was sitting down talking to the manager of internet Crimes against children here in the state of Idaho. We have a division that does that and that's their whole job. I said, sir, is my bill worthless because I'm not doing all this social media, all I'm doing is search engines and I was afraid he was going to say yes, it's worthless, but he didn't. He says, no, says what happens. It's usually the innocent eight, nine, 10-year-old that is out searching for things like greatest baseball moments in history, and they do that search and sooner or later you will get a link that pops up that has objectional material harmful for minors that will happen. This bill says, no way. It's not going to happen. If I click on that link and it has the objectional material, it will tell me, sorry, we filtered that.

(05:04):

You cannot see that. Now what if I need to see it? Okay, what if I'm doing a history class or an assignment where I need to do some studying and I need to see that website and it's blocked. I can still go to mom and dad and say, mom, I need to see this. I need to be able to see this website because this is the study I'm doing on it. And so they can make that decision. Parents can unblock that website and let it go forward. But how often was that going to happen? I don't believe it's going to happen very often. A big example that people often use is, what about Michelangelo's statue? David, right? Beautiful statue. Statue. Well, is it going to block that? I got news for you. We are getting very, very good software wise recognizing the difference from flesh and marble.

(06:00):

You hear about ai, we're getting really smart with our computers almost. It's almost scary, but these are smart devices and we can get the filter on there and we can recognize the difference and we can steer that. There's lots of good stuff in this. It is not taking your first amendment right. In fact, this bill is patterned after the Supreme Court's suggestion coming out of the Ashcroft versus the ACL. That's what it's based on. And so it's got the age verification on there. It's a good bill, but it is not the perfect bill. It will not block everything. Your kids can still get harmful stuff, harmful to minors using social media. That still can happen, but we're just suggesting very, very narrow. And you might say, well, why not go after the Smart TVs and the Xbox and everything else? And simply because there's too much too many people that will come and fight against it. And so we're just doing it very narrow and I need your support to get it across the finish line. I need anybody and everybody's support on this bill. If you want to go look at it, you can look at it. The legislative Idaho Republic legislator, you can go out to Kevin Cook for Idaho and I've got that bill there. You can download it, you can look at it and I hope you'll sign up as a supporter of it. So that's kind of in a nutshell. Maybe I went too long. I

Representative Stephanie Mickelsen, District 32 ID (07:40):

Was going to say I'm really excited about Kevin's bill because as a mother and a grandmother and having studied a lot about this, addictions start when kids are young and they generally happen through a device and most people don't want to say that they're trying to attack it from other ways, but the reality is it's coming on devices to small kids and before they know it, they're addicted to it and they don't know how to get away from it. So this is a great opportunity for parents to have a block in that process of even getting kids started down that road.

Senator Kevin Cook, District 32 Idaho (08:17):

So I've talked to a lot of parents about this and a lot of politicians and lobbyists and a lot of 'em say, just take the phone away. Yeah, that's an option. You could certainly take the phone away or the mobile device and take it away, but we do so much on those mobile devices nowadays. There is so much good information that it's important for them to be able to have access. Even if you say, I'm not going to purchase my son or daughter mobile device. Okay, that's fine, but sooner or later they're going to need something to do. Some, they'll use yours to play a game or to go out and research and search on some stuff. Wouldn't it be nice to know that? Yeah, I can give my mobile device to a son or daughter, a grandchild and not worry about what's going to pop up.

(09:09):

And most parents talk to their kids. If you see that harmful material for minors, come and talk to me and they go over and over again. Well, when an eight, nine, 10-year-old sees it for the first time, they are so embarrassed coming and talking to mom and dad is the last thing on their mind. Or they're so curious that there's no way that they'll come and talk to you. And so it's just something to help you as parents and I think it will be a great help to you. You can still turn if you want your child to see that you have the right, you can turn it off. You can turn it on. You can do whatever you want. And maybe just, Brenda, if I keep talking too much, you get me started on this and I just can't stop. But the other thing about this is some people say, well, you're getting inside of my bubble.

(10:05):

You don't do that. And these mobile devices, they're already inside your bubble whether you like it or not. And we're not asking them to do anything more than they're already doing. We're not asking that. We're not requiring, we're not telling 'em how to do that. But they do know where you're at and they know if you're in the state of Idaho or if you're in New York. And just think about it, when you fly from here to East Coast, your mobile device changes through the time zone, daylight savings time. When it came to an end of November, it changed without you doing anything. The people in Arizona, it didn't change because they don't participate it. So your mobile device knows where you're at. I'll stop talking there.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (10:54):

No, senator, your passion on this issue is contagious. And I appreciate Representative Mickelson giving us a perspective of what she's done. It's hard to go through a day and not see a mugshot of people in our community who are going behind bars for a long time for accessing or sharing explicit material that involves minors. And it's heartbreaking and we're disgusted when we read what they were involved in. And it's hard not to think mint, what can we do to stop this epidemic? It's been referred to as the new drug. We laugh when you use the word, it starts with P and rhymes with geography because we've been told that if we use certain words on here that it'll flag our podcast. So that's why you're hearing the senator use words like obscene material, explicit. My grandfather would call it smut, right? And that's what this is, is there's smut out there, Senator. A lot of people are listening and they're like Representative Mickelson saying, this is a no-brainer. This is something we should be doing, but you couldn't quite get it across the finish line last session. Help us understand where the opposition is coming from and what we're doing to be able to squash that this upcoming session.

Senator Kevin Cook, District 32 Idaho (12:03):

Alright, so this is the third year. I've tried to bring it last year. It mis passing the Senate on the floor by one vote. I think. Well, I thought I had the votes last year or two up to a week before, and then everything kind of fell apart this year. I think I have the votes. I hope I have the votes. I'm trying. Well, my hardest to work that and I need you guys to talk to legislators across the state, your friends and neighbors to call their legislators and not just in your area. Because in your area, I think everybody is going to vote for this bill, but it's across the rest of the state. If you have friends and neighbors, get them to help. So last year my bill was scored by the Idaho Freedom Foundation as a negative five. Negative is bad, positive is good in reality.

(13:00):

And then that's how they score it and they did a negative five. So they analyze the bill and they give it points based on where they feel like it fits. And so this year the bill changed just a little bit, but this year I got a negative eight. Negative eight is huge. There's not many bills that go beyond a negative four. And so I have a negative eight. And why? Well, as you read through their reasoning, and I've got that and I've read through everything that they've gone and I've went and commented on it and I just think, I don't know what they're reading. I don't know. I think they've got the wrong bill. I don't know what they're reading because the stuff does not make sense. But you know what I did late last night? It was kind of an interesting exercise, is I removed filter from their analysts, their document removed and or filter and put in the word librarian.

(14:09):

I removed the word, the P word or device and put books. Now I don't know if you know it, but the Idaho Freedom Foundation is all over this library. Bill house bill three. Yeah. Well, so I just took the same stuff I'm doing and replaced it with library and with books and it fits perfectly. There is really no difference objectional material. And yet they're willing to throw a librarian in prison but not hold two or three people at the very top of some of the biggest companies in the nation and hold them accountable for doing the same thing that they're saying the librarian has done. There is no difference. There is no difference at all. They're still disseminating

Representative Stephanie Mickelsen, District 32 ID (15:17):

Harmful material for

Senator Kevin Cook, District 32 Idaho (15:18):

Minors, harmful material for minors, the P word. Okay? They're still doing that. And we are the greatest nation on earth and we're dealing with this kind of crap. And if you want to have it as an adult, great, but it's not good for our children. The state of Idaho recognizes that the federal government, our nation, recognizes that it's in our law books. It is against the law to disseminate in any form objectional material harmful to our minors. And so I need your help pass it. There's those that are fighting against it. And you might say, well, why? And it's because big money, big tech money. And the lawyer that they had come and turn the thing last year was a lobbyist for your big social media, Google, Twitter, all of those. That's where he worked at. He was a lobbyist and a lawyer and he kind of turned the corner and the things he said were not true. The things that IFF have written up in this analyst is not true. I am not sure they even read the right bill. It's not right.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (16:42):

Well, but I'll say if campaign season rolled around and you had a candidate that said, I am against protecting children. I am against empowering parents. I am for human trafficking, I'm for grooming. If you had a candidate that said these things, they would be unelectable. And yet your bill that does the opposite. We're finding there are people who are voting against it, who it really doesn't match the way some people campaign. So you know, got a big supporter in me of this bill. Senator, if somebody really is filling so strong right now, what's the best way? You mentioned reaching out to other legislators. How might they go about helping you get this bill across the finish line?

Senator Kevin Cook, District 32 Idaho (17:26):

First off, go to www.kevincookforidaho.com. There's a strip menu across the top and it has bills. Click on that and there's one in there that says, who's supporting this bill? Go down there and sign up your name. That's one. Get familiar with the bill, know what it says, know what it's doing so you can talk the talk. Not that you have to argue, but just to be able to talk the talk. And again, if you're listening to this and you're in southeast Idaho, I believe all of the legislators in southeast Idaho are for this. And so you've got to talk to some friends that are in different sections of Idaho and get them to call their legislators and get them on board. Again, it's not the perfect bill. It does not take every objectional material from children. It does a small part and it's a start to keep the innocence in our children intact. You're eight, nine, and 10 years old and don't think that they don't ever see that. They do. I've talked to hundreds of young men and young women that their first

Representative Stephanie Mickelsen, District 32 ID (18:41):

Exposure,

Senator Kevin Cook, District 32 Idaho (18:42):

Exposure to this stuff was when they were eight, nine, and 10 years old and they were not looking for it. They stumbled onto it accidentally. We can do better. We can simply do better

Representative Stephanie Mickelsen, District 32 ID (18:56):

And we should do better.

Senator Kevin Cook, District 32 Idaho (18:58):

Yep.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (18:59):

I love that. Okay. We can do better. We should do better and we're going to do better now. You two are late for meetings, so we're going to have to cut it off there. But thank you so much. Senator Kevin Cook, representative Stephanie Mickelson, we really appreciate you taking the time to chat with us today.

Representative Stephanie Mickelsen, District 32 ID (19:13):

Thank you, Brendan.

Senator Kevin Cook, District 32 Idaho (19:15):

Appreciate it.

Eric Stamps 1/22/24 Eric Stamps 1/22/24

Main Street Town Hall Episode 3—Senator Cook & Rep. Mickelsen

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Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (00:00):

Welcome to Main Street Podcast, an opportunity to talk to Idaho's elected leaders about the issues that matter to you. Welcome back to the Idaho Main Street podcast. I'm your host, Brennan Summers. In England, they have a term they use kind of a s slang term. They say chuffed. Well chuffed. And it means you're very pleased or very happy. And today I'm well chuffed to have two really good friends, people that I've known for years back on the podcast to talk about some issues. We've got Senator Kevin Cook and representative Stephanie Michelson, both out of district 32. Senator, thanks for joining us today.

Senator Kevin Cook, District 32 Idaho (00:39):

Oh, thank you. I'm excited,

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (00:42):

Representative. Good to see you. How are you?

Representative Stephanie Mickelsen, District 32 ID (00:45):

I'm doing better. Got a little colder laryngitis this week, so if I sound scratchy, it's not intentional.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (00:51):

Okay, noted. Yeah, you sound good. It's coming through. Well, we we're really excited. The idea of this season of the podcast is we've got two people on the inside of the State House right now, you two that can talk to issues. We've had Senator lent on, and if you haven't listened to his episode, any of our listeners out there, he talks about school facilities and get on and listen to that. But this is kind of like insider baseball for nerds. We get to talk about the proposals and the issues that are coming up and we're really excited to talk about those. Education is an issue that we talk a lot about on the podcast and it seems to be an issue that the legislature spends a lot of time with. Senator Cook, I'm going to come to you first. Why is it that you think that education issues kind of take up so much time and attention in the State House these days?

Senator Kevin Cook, District 32 Idaho (01:39):

Because it's the number one priority in the state. I believe it's our future, our children, that's where it's at. They're going to be here after we go. They're the ones that when we get old and they're laying around, they're the ones that are going to be taking the torch and moving forward. So we need to take care of 'em, make sure they're educated, they know the history and what's going forward. If we don't, we'll all be sorry.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (02:06):

Yeah. So it's justified you're saying the time that we spend on education.

Senator Kevin Cook, District 32 Idaho (02:10):

Absolutely. Yep. It needs to take a majority of our time.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (02:15):

Representative Mickelson, when you first ran for office, you talked about being a former art mom that was spent a lot of time in the classroom and throughout your first session in the legislature you worked on a lot of education issues and you came out very quickly in favor of supporting choice in schools in Idaho, the choice we have, but strongly against the idea of a voucher program or sending private dollars, or excuse me, sending public dollars to private institutions. There's been a proposal that's been talked about recently. We'd love to talk a little bit about today that would give a tax credit, educational tax credit to students attending private schools through public funds, the tax credit of IT representative, why don't you talk a little bit more about what this proposal will do and then your initial response to it.

Representative Stephanie Mickelsen, District 32 ID (03:03):

So I've met with the sponsors of the bill and they kind of outlined some of the proposals. They wouldn't give me an actual copy of their bill, but so far from what I've learned, they're going to have $10 million. It would be for grants upfront for low income families. That is a means tested, but they would have $40 million that would then go to families through a $5,000 per child grant or not grant, but educational tax credit. So it would come right off the bottom line on their taxes and one of the committees I serve on is rev and tax. And so to have that come right off of their taxes and then it affects the way that Jfa can then in future years go budget money because the tax credit comes right off the top and then future allocations of the general fund come after this tax credit. So that part of the proposal really concerns me along with several other options that are in there.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (03:59):

Okay, perfect. Senator, one thing we love about you is you're very thoughtful in the way that you kind of weigh pros and cons of legislation. And we know there's not bill text yet, there's not a bill number. So you haven't seen a bill in front of you, but as you look at the philosophy of public dollars for private institutions, what are your initial reactions to this proposal? How are you feeling about it?

Senator Kevin Cook, District 32 Idaho (04:23):

Excuse me. First off, I am for school choice and we have school choice in Idaho. And in fact in Idaho Falls we have a wide array of choices, which not everybody in Idaho has what we have in Idaho or in Idaho Falls. So as a member of jac, I'm a little concerned about that your tax credit takes effect before JAC ever gets to see that money. It's gone. It never enters the general fund. It's gone. And so for a member of JAC to say, okay, now we want to go ahead and budget it, well it's gone. It's not there. It's not part of our revenue after that point. And we've had other bills that have kind of done the same thing or tried to do the same thing. And for the most part we says, no, we're not going to do that because it really does take it off. And JAC will never see that unless you go back and revisit it, but it won't show up as a revenue, it's

Representative Stephanie Mickelsen, District 32 ID (05:30):

Gone. Well, I think it's a little disingenuous if I can jump in this conversation for somebody to say this won't affect budgets. Because the reality is if that money comes up off the top and you have a downturn in the economy and you have to start making cuts throughout the budget, these guys, this tax credit will come before anything else. So when you say it won't affect anything else, it's going to affect your police protection, your transportation funding. It could affect funding, building funding, any other things that come out of the same pot of money. And so this misinformation campaign that's going on that it doesn't cost public education is not true because it's going to come out of the state budget and the state budget is the state budget. The coffers are the same whether you siphon money off here or you siphon it off there, the amount of money that they have to spend remains within this pot of resources.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (06:31):

Yeah, exactly. So Senator, you bring up the point that Representative Mickelson carries on that with the money is kind of earmarked before it's appropriated. You don't have the ability to budget it. What else, Senator is at risk in the general fund that you are deciding as J fac to fund? What other programs are funded in Idaho out of that pot of money?

Senator Kevin Cook, District 32 Idaho (06:56):

Oh, basically everything. So your department of land, your agricultural, which is huge for Idaho, your agricultural, your regular public school, your higher education, wealth welfare, Medicaid, all of that stuff, it's lowered. The amount of money that you have to work with is going to be lowered because that came out before we ever get it, get to see it, get to appropriate it to any other budget.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (07:32):

Representative Mickelson, you've mentioned before that other states have done similar things. What have we seen as the byproduct of states like Arizona, Wisconsin who have passed similar legislation?

Representative Stephanie Mickelsen, District 32 ID (07:44):

So what we're seeing across the board in other states who have adopted ESAs, educational vouchers, tax credits, whatever you want to call them, because at the end of the day it's all this movement, a federal movement or a national movement to basically discredit, defund and then dismantle public education. And so what happens is they come in with just this little line item and say, we're only going to spend this much and it's going to stay that way. But then quickly they get all these people buying into it and pretty soon it just outpaces their budget. Right now they're going to have a $400 million shortfall in Arizona and they're spending a billion dollars on these tax credits or vouchers, whatever you want to call 'em in Florida. Within a three year time, they went from spending 130 million to 1.3 billion. Indiana is the other state that came in and has given us a presentation and they said it went three times with they're planning and then it went seven times with their planning.

(08:52):

And I think another interesting point to bring out in this is you're bringing kids into the system that you're paying for that had never been in the system. These were families that were wealthy families and they get their nose in the door saying they're doing this for the poor kids or for the socioeconomically challenged children. But at the end of the day, it's really an entitlement program for the wealthy people to get their taxes back. And we have a responsibility as state legislators to look at what's best for our state. And there's a couple of specific problems that we have legally with it, and there are two constitutional problems with it. The first one is the blame amendment. The blame amendment. They refer to it as the blame amendment, but it's basically the amendment to our constitution or a part of our constitution that said, we will have separation of church and state.

(09:46):

They were particularly worried in the 18 hundreds when they put this in about the Catholics in the Mormons and they did not want to see any particular religion controlling the state. And so they put that in there as a protection. And we have honored that and we have not pierced that bell of the blame amendment. There's been several articles in education news and other places that have pointed out that we haven't yet. But once we do, then if we pay for private schools, we have to pay for parochial schools, for religious schools. We could be paying for the School of the Satanic Cult. We could be paying for the school of the neo-Nazi skinheads or the School of the Sharia law. And so you get into a very slippery slope once you go down that pattern. That's the first constitutional problem with it. The second one is we have, as part of our constitution, it says that we believe that for the benefit of all society, we need an educated electorate.

(10:44):

We believe in common, thorough free public education. It does not say private education. And like Senator Cook said, he said he supports school choice and I do too. And last year we voted on a bill to make that possible that you can go to any school that you want to in the state of Idaho that's a public school or a public charter school, but when you start funding people's private decisions with public tax dollars, we have a sacred trust to use those in the way that fits the constitution that we have to follow. So that's a real concern for me. I don't know what Senator Cook thinks about that, but

Senator Kevin Cook, District 32 Idaho (11:21):

Let me just add one of my other concerns if that's okay. Brennan, please. Again, I haven't seen this bill that's coming up and you might think, well, why haven't you? I says, well, it hasn't come to the Senate side yet. As soon as it does, I will make time for it. But we had a similar bill with the idea of the state's going to put some money in here and you have no accountability. And in fact, that was one of the allegations that the central committee came out against me about for voting against that bill simply because if I am representing you, I'm taking your tax money and I'm going to give it to somebody that has no oversight of how that money is spent. I don't know about you, but that would be the last person that I would vote for as a taxpayer myself and as representing you as taxpayers, I believe wherever I put that money, we better have some kind of oversight and be able to see what's going on there. Again, I don't know if this bill has that, but my guess it probably does, but we need to have an oversight of where the money's going.

Representative Stephanie Mickelsen, District 32 ID (12:38):

Help us. I think there's two prongs of oversight, so lemme jump in here. The two prongs of oversight are tax dollar spending, but it's also oversight in curriculum and content content and kids actually progressing. So there's two ways that we need to have some sort of accountability and I'm told by the bill maker that they'll have it because the state tax commission can audit you. Well, I don't know about many of you, but I don't want the IRS in my back pocket auditing me and we're saying we're going to open it up so you can be audited for a school voucher, but yet we're not going to have any accountability to the school. And the thing I've heard from multiple people is they want accountability for the schools that they're having kids progress, and yet we're going to with these educational tax credit entitlement programs, we're going to turn around and just give them 5,000 bucks and we're not going to expect any kind of outcome for the amount of money we're spending.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (13:32):

Representative. Help us understand how in a lot of these states what the projected cost of this was ends up increasing so much. So what they thought it was going to be, why is it that they see in a matter of years such exponential growth in the cost?

Representative Stephanie Mickelsen, District 32 ID (13:52):

Well, for one thing, what they saw in Arizona was as soon as they issued tax credits, then people or the schools would then raise their tuition and then they would also have what they call strip mall schools that would just pop up in strip malls. They would take people's money then they didn't even necessarily have to finish providing an education, took people's money and then they could even disappear. Then you've got a kid or a parent that's got to take a kid back into the public school system or then pay for another system. And then you also did what they called stacking of vouchers. And so you could get, not only could a parent have a tax credit, but you could have businesses theoretically speaking could apply for it as long as a hundred percent of that went to the kid for their education. As a business owner, I could then say, I'm giving out a million dollars in scholarships, give out these tax credits.

(14:48):

I look like I'm a great business. I can give tax credits or I can give out vouchers for schools or scholarships and the cost goes up exponentially and then they don't think about the participation. But once privately educated parents, privately educated kids, their parents figure out they can have a way to have the taxpayer pay for it. They're all in. Part of the problem with this bill, from what I've been told from the sponsor is that it's going to be a $40 million first come first serve. So you know what that tells me? It's the person with the best accountant. That's the first one in the door that's going to get their money. But anybody later on down the list, it's going to be out of luck. And I don't think that's good tax policy either.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (15:32):

Sure, sure. Senator, you talk about accountability and the importance of that and it's clear that you take your role as safeguarding public funds very seriously. What is it that your constituents, the taxpayers have told you about this type of proposal, but also there are other priorities when it comes to education funding?

Senator Kevin Cook, District 32 Idaho (15:54):

Yeah, people want to know where their tax money's going to. They want to make sure it's going to something good and something that they can say, yeah, I can hold up my flagpole and say I'm on board with that. And that's not always the case. Sometimes it gets spent somewhere that's not my priority, but might be my neighbor's priority. So that doesn't always happen. But boy, we need to be able to show what the money's being used for and how it's being used. And are we being successful? Are we educating kids? Are they moving forward? Today in J fac, we had a federal grant come up and we want to know, okay, we're spending money. What are we getting for that? Is it being successful? Do we know what success looks like to begin with? And how do we audit that and prove that? Yeah, it's being successful.

(16:55):

It doesn't mean just, oh, look at everybody that signed up for it. Just because they signed up for it doesn't mean it's success. What's going to happen on a year from now or two years or six months? What's going on behind that? So that's important, but again, there's limited money in the state of Idaho, you can't do everything you want. And my number one priority is figuring out ways to do facilities. I think that's important. And I think the majority of Idaho is interested in getting some facilities on board. You've got a school in, you always hear the bad sad stories. And it is sad in salmon where they've got sewage running underneath the open sewage, running underneath the school, met with six superintendents across the state for the different regions this morning for a half an hour talking about facilities and what we could do.

(17:50):

And one of the things that I was telling us, it would be nice to have a cookie cutter standardized facility plan for elementary, middle school, and high school wasn't a big Taj MA hall, but we put the money in the classroom, not on the outside. And we build this standard school and we get really, really good at it. We vet it and we put that across the state. And I would like to see that be part of the governor's plan for facilities. And it might not be part of it this year, but hopefully next year maybe. But I think facilities for me, number one priority, we got to get that.

Representative Stephanie Mickelsen, District 32 ID (18:31):

Well, and the Supreme Court has said that the state of Idaho is responsible for the building of those schools. That's what the Supreme Court said. And so I think that we try to kick this can down the road, but I'm with Senator Cook on this one. We need to focus on having buildings. And like he says, we'll have to have plans for small, medium and large sized school districts. But that's one way we can really make inefficiency in the system is by doing things like he's talking about. And then if the community wants to come in and build a Taj Mahal of the gym on the side of their plan, great. We don't care. Right? No, that's local control

Senator Kevin Cook, District 32 Idaho (19:09):

And that's important. As representative Mickelson said, we're not saying the state come in and supply all the money and build the school for 'em. Now there still needs to be skin in the game. Local control still needs to be there, but I do believe that the state needs to step up a little bit, otherwise we're going to face a suit and again, waste the money. So we don't need that, so we need to do something with it.

Representative Stephanie Mickelsen, District 32 ID (19:36):

One other thing that was important with the Arizona system, what they found by the time they were in it, just a few short years that spending on vouchers went from rural areas to the urban areas, and on average was costing $300,000 per school building in the state of Arizona. That money didn't go to that program at that particular building. That's per building, not per district, per building. Can you imagine what would happen if we did that across the state of Idaho within say four or five years? We had that same scenario. Think about local property tax owners. They're going to have to go past bonds to levies to just keep their doors open. Other school, if we go down this road, I think it's financially, physically completely irresponsible and for people to say they're conservative and support this, I think it's a total contradiction myself.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (20:33):

Yeah. So we've spent the majority of the time here talking about the issues that we have philosophically and fiscally with public dollars going towards private institutions. I don't want this to seem all doom and gloom. It's pretty clear that both of you would have issues with that idea. I want to wrap up today talking about maybe something a little more optimistic about what gets you excited about education yet, Senator, you talked about what we can do with school facilities and representative, you came in on that too, of how important this is our constitutional obligation. What else when it comes to education policy do you see on the horizon that gets you excited? Let's start with you, representative.

Representative Stephanie Mickelsen, District 32 ID (21:13):

Man, that's a loaded question. I guess as I visited with local schools within my district, probably the poorest one within my district, they have a problem that has happened after Covid, and that's that parents are having to use their older children for childcare for their younger children. And we have huge deficits in some of these poor socioeconomic class schools. And sometimes some of their ideas were maybe we need to lengthen the day of the school for these children in certain areas because the socioeconomic class pays a big role in it, and attendance has become a huge issue. So we've got to figure out, and Jac rightfully so, has now tied funding to average daily attendance. But now school districts and even the state, we've got to figure out because they've done some serious studies on this and the absences are causing tremendous problems and learning losses for children.

(22:19):

I had somebody tell me just yesterday, a superintendent, they had one kid and they were in a new semester and they've already missed 40 days out of it and they're going to lose credit. But the reality was the young man had to go to work to help support the family. So when we talk education, we've got to make sure that we get the youngest of the young, we get them learning to read, get 'em engaged in realizing that school is their job every single day, and we need 'em to do a great job at their job and then get 'em excited and feel like school is a safe and happy place for them.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (22:53):

Fantastic. Senator, what comes to your mind as you look on the horizon of education policy in Idaho that you look forward to?

Senator Kevin Cook, District 32 Idaho (23:00):

Well, I am still excited about launch. I just think this is a great bill and we're still getting a little fallout from it. There's still the knife in the back and twisting it a little bit that we're getting. But I am really excited about what the possibilities of what that can do. We have a different generation. We can say, well, I paid for everything and worked hard. And then partially that's true, but we often forget, well, how much did the state pay for your tuition, your university career or your high school? A lot of times we forget about that. There is money all the way. You didn't pay it all by yourself. But this launch program, as a technical person, I look at for a century, America led the technical piece in the world. We were on top of it. China over the last decade is catching up with us.

(24:02):

And we can sit back and say, you just let those kids, you let those kids find their own way and pay their own way. And that's a great idea. But another couple of years, I'm not going to be able to go out and fight to save my liberty. And it's going to be a different way. It's going to be fought through hacking into banks and electrical grid systems and everything like that. And I'll tell you what, we need some smart, sharp kids. And part of that is going to come through education. We need nuclear energy. We need kids that can fit engineers that can come and figure out how to build nuclear plants and improve upon that. Everything we look at points back to technology. You can't pick up a newspaper who doesn't newspaper anymore. You can't read anything on the internet except for something about ai. AI is something new. And it's exciting what we can do with that. And in my opinion, launch is going to help us get to that point where the next generation is going to keep America free, going to keep our liberty and our rights. And it comes with education. And that's a cost that all of us need to do, and it's worth it.

Representative Stephanie Mickelsen, District 32 ID (25:23):

And I'll add that CEI has seen huge jumps in all their enrollments across the board. They have all their major programs are completely full, and they could open up a whole nother section on several of them and have those completely full. So kids are really taking advantage of this tremendous opportunity that they've been given. And I think we should all be excited about what Launch can do for keeping our children back in the state of Idaho rather than sending them, shipping them out of state permanently.

Senator Kevin Cook, District 32 Idaho (25:52):

And maybe just add another thing. There's a lot of people that are really, really don't want it and are ticked about it. There needs to remember there is a sunset on this. If it doesn't work and it might not, okay, then it comes to an end and we don't fund it anymore, and we find out another way. We try another way. And that's what we as Americans do. We try something, if it doesn't work, we try something else, and that's where we're at. But boy, I'm excited to see where we're going. And the start has certainly got every indication that it's going to be a great success.

Brennan Summers, Main Street ID Executive Director (26:29):

Yeah. Inspiring comments from both of you as we look forward to the future. Now, you two don't go anywhere. We've got a few more things we need to talk about, but for this episode, that's all the time we have. So to our listeners, thanks for joining and we again appreciate Senator Representative Stephanie Mickelson, district 32 joining us today. Thank

Representative Stephanie Mickelsen, District 32 ID (26:47):

You. Thank you.

Eric Stamps 1/17/24 Eric Stamps 1/17/24

Main Street Town Hall Episode 2—Senator Dave Lent

A New Vision For Investing in Idaho Schools

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The 2024 legislative session is in full swing!

We’ve made significant investments in Idaho’s students and teachers in recent years. The time has come to extend those investments to the classrooms and facilities we provide for our kids and educators. We know that not every district and community comes with the same financial resources, which helps explain some of the challenges of building and maintaining schools.

For decades, we’ve relied primarily on property taxes to pay for bonds to build and levies to fix. Bonds require a super-majority vote to pass, and with increased building costs, failure to secure a bond in one year can mean a bigger price tag the next year. It can make long-term planning a challenge for districts that want to do right by their students while respecting the wishes of taxpayers.

Today’s podcast guest, Senator Dave Lent, has worked with other legislators for almost four years to find an alternative.

We need an approach that looks more like how we tackle roads and bridges.

We need a better, more sustainable way to build and maintain our state’s education facilities.

Lent represents District 33 (Bonneville County) in the Idaho Senate. He also serves as chairman of the Education Committee. In today’s podcast episode, he goes into detail on the new vision for investing in Idaho schools.

Senator Lent was thrilled to hear Gov. Little share his support for a statewide plan to provide targeted relief for school districts and property owners.

The initial proposal calls for redirecting $125 million in sales tax revenue annually toward new bonds over the next 10 years. School districts can then access these funds, reducing the need for bonds and levies in their communities. The money cannot go towards facilities like football stadiums. If districts and their taxpayers want those extras, they’ll need to gain support from the community to cover those costs.

Our focus with this investment comes down to kids having a safe place where they can attend school each day. Something as simple as a steady temperature shouldn’t be a challenge. Yet, in a recent survey, almost 70% of Idaho’s superintendents reported problems with their heating and cooling systems. Other challenges include concerns about accessibility for students with disabilities, building security, and general structural problems.

None of these issues are surprising, given the age of some buildings and the struggles to keep them repaired. Roofs don’t last forever, water systems will spring leaks, and electrical systems will go on the fritz. It’s a reality with every building, but Idaho students deserve better. There’s a way to accomplish this goal without increasing the burden on Idaho property owners.

Senator Lent is proud of the tax relief we passed in H292 last session. Beyond reducing property taxes, it also directed funds to our school districts to help offset the cost to taxpayers for bonds and levies. Adopting a targeted approach focused on buildings and maintenance this year represents the next step toward supporting our students while delivering ongoing tax relief.

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…

Main Street Town Hall Episode 1—Superintendent Debbie Critchfield

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Main Street Town Hall Episode 8—Senator Treg Bernt

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Main Street Town Hall Episode 7—Senator Todd Lakey

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A New Vision For Investing in Idaho Schools

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